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    Vatican flunks Pepsi Challenge on Stem Cells?
    By Paul Knoepfler | March 26th 2012 12:08 PM | 7 comments | Print | E-mail | Track Comments
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    Associate Professor of Cell Biology and Human Anatomy at UC Davis School of Medicine. Long-time stem cell and cancer scientist. Cancer survivor...

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    It's a confusing time at the Vatican, which has an international stem cell scandal of its own making on its hands.

    What the heck is going on?

    In an embarrassing move, they organized a stem cell conference for this year and then abruptly cancelled it, with the reason being that they had originally invited a number of prominent embryonic stem cell supporters/researchers to be speakers. There appears to be a huge schism in the Church over stem cells as one faction organized this conference and intentionally invited embryonic stem cell research leaders and then apparently higher ups, who got the vapors, cancelled the meeting.

    The organizers of the meeting, at which Pope Benedict XVII was going to speak (see picture above right from Nature), had invited some of the top stem cell researchers in the world and then cancelled the meeting because these researchers were going to be there, a real slap in the face to the legitimate stem cell community.

    Nature reports mixed feelings in the stem cell community not only over the meeting itself, but also regarding its cancellation.

    Alan Trounson, President of CIRM, was quoted “I think the only interpretation is that we are being censored." Dr. Trounson is right.

    Another leading stem cell researcher who was invited, Dr. George Daley, says he was asked specifically not to make embryonic stem cells the focus of his talk, but "he planned to discuss them for historical context."

    Many stem cell researchers, including Dr. Christine Mummery, decided to decline invitations to this meeting in the first place because she was convinced it wasn't going to be an "open discussion at all" and the adult stem cell researchers were going to be portrayed as the good guys, while the embryonic stem cell researchers were going to be the bad guys. I also raised this question in a piece called "Vatican Stem Cell Meeting 2.0: from stem cells to prison cells to hell?" of whether by attending, prominent stem cell researchers were tacitly giving some legitimacy to an ideologically harmful meeting, but at the same time I wondered if by going some of the stem cell leaders might do some significant good by fostering a healthy dialogue.

    The Nature piece also quotes a Vatican official who had been involved in organizing the meeting who says he thought the program was worthy:

    Monsignor Jacques Suaudeau, Officer for Studies at the Pontifical Academy for Life, called the cancellation a “sad event” in an e-mail to Nature, and said that attendees would soon receive an official explanation. “I cannot speak until the letter of explanation is given. All what I can say is that until this Friday, the congress was well on its way and that we thought that the programme, as it was, was worthy.” 

    I believe it is clear that the Vatican is split on the stem cell issue and the handling of this meeting exemplifies that divide.

    This whole thing reminds me of the Pepsi Challenge from decades ago, perhaps because Pepsi is also in the news lately over, in its case, a manufactured fake stem cell controversy. The Pepsi Challenge was (and perhaps still is?) a marketing approach Pepsi used to eat into the market share of Coke. It began when I was 8 years old in 1975. Pepsi did commercials of blind taste tests where people were given sips of Pepsi and Coke, without knowing which was which, and reportedly most people like Pepsi better.

    I'd like to give the Stem Cell Challenge to the Vatican. If someone at the Vatican had a certain condition and needed a therapy that would only work if it were based on embryonic stem cells, would they take it? What if someone asked them do you want stem cell therapy A, which doesn't work, or therapy B, which does work (but were not told which was adult and which was embryonic", which one would they pick? Which would "taste" better? I think they'd pick the one that worked and for some medical conditions that will be embryonic stem cell therapies.

    Comments

    MikeCrow
    Paul, I have a question on embryonic therapies, once developed would they be based on cell clones, or would they require 'fresh' cells?
    Never is a long time.
    pknoepfler
    Hi Mi Cro,That's a great question. 

    Generally, once established as clonal lines, no new cells/blastocysts are needed. 

    The ES cells can be expanded to billions or potentially even trillions of cells to make whole tissues, but scientists are still learning how to best do that. The ES cells themselves grow so well that you can grow them up initially in the billions and freeze down almost a limitless stock in liquid nitrogen. 

    The cells are established from leftover blastocysts from fertility treatments (IVF) that are otherwise thrown away 99.9999% of the time. Thus, people who are opposed to ES cell research to be consistent should be just as opposed or more so to IVF, but generally they are afraid of being critical of IVF. ES cells are not made from abortions, although there are a few companies doing research on fetal neural stem cells that do come from aborted fetuses. I'm not involved in that and have not weighed in publicly on my thoughts on that (yet).

    The main need for new ES cell lines comes from the fact that every line has different properties such as differentiation tendencies, mutations, etc. Newer lines tend to be far superior because science continues to progress and scientists each year  know more about how to grow better lines without contaminating animal proteins that can come from growth media, etc. Therefore as science continues to progress, stem cell scientists will continue to get better and better at making clinically relevant ES cell lines so there will continue to be a need for a small number of new lines.  The advantage of older lines, perhaps the only one, is that we a relatively large knowledge base about them from years of study.
    Paul
    Paul S. Knoepfler, Ph.D. Associate Professor UC Davis School of Medicine http://www.ipscell.com
    MikeCrow
    Thanks Paul.
    If I can offer any advise, I'd suggest the scientist working in ES explain the point that once established, a continuing source of cells will not be needed.

    My issue is I don't want to see poor women getting paid to become tissue factories, having abortion after abortion so it can be used as therapies.
    I'm sure there are some who just don't want any fetal tissue used, but i think there are a lot more who feel as i do.
    Never is a long time.
    Hank
    Good title!  But I think the 'schism', as you call it, should be applauded while you seem to think it is a weakness.  A weird cult that has no disagreement and only promotes ideology and science it agrees with is just that...a weird cult. Clearly the church reflects broader society - when the technology to create hESCs was new there was caution and as the public has gotten more comfortable with hESC, so has the church.  That's a good thing.

    Obviously hESC researchers should do what regular stem cell researchers did 40 years ago and be part of the solution instead of looking for ways to criticize religious people when they do positive things, like cancel a conference that they don't all agree on rather than force one side or the other to cave in on their morals.


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    pknoepfler
    Science includes as a fundamental element communication and people with differing views engaging in dialogue is sometimes the most important type of communication.

    I think the key phrase from your comment is "a conference that they don't all agree on"....I respect a diversity of opinions on the hESC issue as it is certainly complex, but because of that diversity we cannot always (perhaps never!) meet that hurdle of a consensus of everyone agreeing before we even hold a meeting, right?  

    So, we differ on the idea you present in your comment of the cancelation of the meeting being a "positive thing". I think it is a missed opportunity.


    In addition, the invited speakers that were the "problem" are mature, senior scientists who from my experience in the field have a long history of public restraint and respectfulness so I believe that at the meeting they would have done their utmost to engage in a non-provocative dialogue. 

    Paul S. Knoepfler, Ph.D. Associate Professor UC Davis School of Medicine http://www.ipscell.com
    Hank
    Well, clearly we can't hold one side to a standard and not the other.  
    Dr. Christine Mummery, decided to decline invitations to this meeting in the first place because she was convinced it wasn't going to be an "open discussion at all"
    doesn't sound like willingness on her part to engage in any dialogue.  They had basically this same meeting a year ago so if there was an actual schism in the higher echelons about this year's format, and we have no idea what the real reason is, I think it is good they are cleaning their house up before having the meeting or, as Mummery worried, it might have been too one sided.
    Want more no-nonsense, independent science? Buy Science Left Behind
    Daley admits that he intended to review his embryonic stem cell research, Mummery states that she declined because of her beliefs about the "discussion." I'm not surprised that the Vatican reconsidered.
    I would like some reference about that last "Pepsi challenge." I'm not aware of any cell line that wasn't first or subsequently developed from a non-embryonic cell line. (lung tissue - first from umbilical cord cells, cardiac cells in the heart itself, kidney and liver cells, etc. Am I wrong that the cells used in the one or two human trials using embryonic stem cell origin have also been developed without use of embryonic cells.